Date of build?

[Willow And Cane]

Hi,
As we know the MK IV Avon and Carp rods have various versions be it early script or colour of the whippings.

What I am after is there a time line of production with the various versions attributed to a certain time frame?

I have seen rods with “keeper rings” and some without? Are these variations from different years?


Is there any way to tell the approx age of a rod from certain features?


Thanks

[Lea Dweller]

This is a bit of a minefield, but I would suggest that certainly the B.James Mark IV Carp and Avon's line of production is usually defined by handle shape, i.e. Onion and Doughnut. Close whipping seems standard on most models most with hook keepers. Transfers/Logo's are also pretty uniform, but once you go into other Maker's there can be many variations. To keep it simple, It may be easier if you have a rod that you are unsure of, to put up some pictures?

[Barbelseeker]

I know it exists because I have read it on here (99% sure) but I think you ought to look within the Forum "Traditional Rods" - B James Rods, although there are plenty of other links which might contain the information. I post the link:
viewforum.php?f=192

[MaggotDrowner]

You can date them by the shape of the handle. If they're doughnut, onion or trumpet etc. As well as whipping colour, hook keeper etc. Someone with a better memory than me will probably be able to give specifics. If not I'll look for the chart again. It should be on here somewhere. It's where I will have found it to date mine.

[MaggotDrowner]

Here is the post I remember. Second post by Don't Know Much who clearly know s more than his name suggests.

viewtopic.php?f=192&t=406&p=2953

[Willow And Cane]

Many thanks everyone.
MaggotDrowner that is exactly what I am looking for.

[MaggotDrowner]

The information given in Kevin Clifford's A History .... should be a reliable guide.

As follows:

First version- October 1952: Trumpet handle, hook-keeper, shoulder collar, dark built cane. Concentric red, green or black whippings, clear or brown butt and tip rings. Transfer -- 'B.James & Son, Ealing, London'.

Second version- 1955: Onion handle , hook-keeper, no shoulder collar, dark built cane. Concentric red or green whippings, brown coloured butt and tip rings. Transfer logo -- 'B.James & Son, Ealing, London'.

Third version- 1956/1957: Onion handle, hook-keeper, small shoulder collar, medium brown coloured cane, concentric red or green whippings, brown coloured butt and tip rings. Transfer logo -- 'B.James & Son, London, England'.

Fourth version- 1958: Bulbous handle, no shoulder collar or hook keeper, lighter coloured cane, increased test curve, red whippings, brown coloured butt and tip rings. Transfer logo -- 'B.James & Son, England'.

Taking the above into account I think this should only be used as a guide as not all rods out there conform to these descriptions and there are some characteristics which overlapped the different versions. One of my MKIVs for example has all the details mentioned in the third version but has the bulbous (doughnut) handle. I'm figuring its either a late 1957 or an early 1958