Stick floats history

[Stuart Whiting]

Hi Backhand



How so very true backhand, in fact the last few posts you've put up on this page is all good sound advice,
this is all my sought of fishing being a big roach and dace fanatic and take serious interest in any quality discussions like this

Stuart

Thanks Thames Mudlarker

I match fished very seriously for 25 years. Looking back I spent an awful lot of time doing it. But I wouldn't have changed my life for anything. I was happy to catch between 5-8 lb of roach/gudgeon/perch to do well in canal matches. These were 80-100+ peg matches and very competitive. It was great fun trying to compete, plus also trying to come up with new methods that were better than the one's currently being used. My advantage was, that I'm self taught, so I wasn't blinkered by "the method" or even what anyone else was doing. I'm just sad that those days have long gone. Not for me, because I had my day, but anyone doing it now. The majority of matches now are on commercials and if they are lucky might be fishing against 20-30 and sometimes a lot less. In the 70's-90's we actually thought it would go on forever. There are a lot of reason why it didn't, if you had a spare couple of hours I could list them all. Angler's are there worst enemies sometimes and a couple of rule changes would have helped it survive, at least a few years more.
I'm hoping to start posting about floats I made and the reasoning behind them. The actual floats are a pretty basic design, so no one will be blown away by them. I'm hoping it's more the story that goes with design that will be of interest. I very rarely talk to other about fishing, as I have probably got the matcherman's sense of secrecy still installed in me. But I do like telling a story.

Hi backhand,

Please do put up some of your posts regarding floats, I'm sure it'll be rather interesting

A lot of my own fishing skills are self taught, that way you've only got yourself to blame if somethings don't go Wright.....lols

all the best

Stuart

[Backhand]

Hi Backhand



How so very true backhand, in fact the last few posts you've put up on this page is all good sound advice,
this is all my sought of fishing being a big roach and dace fanatic and take serious interest in any quality discussions like this

Stuart

Hi backhand,

Please do put up some of your posts regarding floats, I'm sure it'll be rather interesting

A lot of my own fishing skills are self taught, that way you've only got yourself to blame if somethings don't go Wright.....lols

all the best

Stuart

I had many matches when I tried crazy things to get an edge, the one's that didn't work got forgotten about very quickly. Although some of the slightly less crazy idea's did eventually become part of another plan, that did sometimes work. In a match fishing environment you are always looking to do something different to give yourself an edge.
I once read an article by Ivan Marks, the wording was quite simple, but the meaning behind the words taught me one of my biggest lessons. He said something like " when he fished a big match on the Welland or Witham for Bream. If the majority were using maggot, he would use caster, if the majority were using caster, he would use maggot " I believe this was in one of his books. Most people would just read it for what it said. I understood immediately why he did this. When you are fishing a big match and there are a lot of very good anglers fishing, then if you follow the crowd/majority, you are competing against too many. If you do the opposite and your bait is the right one on the day, then you have narrowed the field down considerably.

[Match Aerial]

Back to the subject of floats. I made some very thin stem avons and sticks a while ago. The stems were 1mm carbon they worked superbly well.

[Backhand]

Trouble is if the alternative bait is the wrong one 9 times out of 10, that approach won't win you much.

he used to do ok, so it must have worked. The theory isn't necessarily a different bait, that was just the synopsis. It's just the thought pattern that a matchman needs to adopt. To narrow down a field of say 100 anglers, you have to be doing something different to the rest. It might be that everyone else is definitely on " the method " but that is seldom true. Fads play a big part in match fishing. The fad only changes once someone else does something different and succeeds. Then the fad becomes the new method. The trick is to be one of the first doing the new fad. That can only happen if you are willing to stick you neck out and try something different, Going back to what I said at the start, it's all about cutting the field down. If you don't you will always be reliant on the luck of the draw. Waiting for that to happen, is a long wait. Sometimes it never happens.
I know some matchman would turn up every week, just hoping it was there week to be lucky in the draw bag. To a certain extent that is what happens on river matches, because it tended to be Chub or Bream that won, so you had no chance unless you drew a Chub or Bream peg. The sort of matches I fished in were much fairer than that and the draw bag didn't play such a big part. It's funny, but I know plenty of swims on the Canal that became so called flyers. They never used to be flyers until someone won the match from them. You could draw a peg and someone would say, that's a flyer, just because 2 years previous, a really good canal angler beat everyone easily from it. But as you may know a different day and a different set of circumstances and the peg might fish completely differently.
I don't know whether any of that makes sense, I hope so.

[Match Aerial]

Yes it makes sense Backhand, Conditions can change a few extra inches off water can make a massive different to the peg. A flyer which only fishes well with no water in can sometime be useless with a couple of foot extra in. I only fish club matches and after a few years you get to know things inside out. But I can imagine fishing big opens would be very different with little knowledge of the river.

MA

[Backhand]

Back to the subject of floats. I made some very thin stem avons and sticks a while ago. The stems were 1mm carbon they worked superbly well.

Sounds really good Match Aerial, have you caught much on them?
I'm sorry my post started to go off topic. I should have made the last 2 into another thread " Mind set of a matchman."
The only sticks I have ever made were wire stemmed sticks. I think I used piano wire, it was along time ago. Although I did once make some really heavy Avon type floats with very long heavy wire in the bottom. These were for fishing on rivers in very heavy/fast flood water. Carried them around for years, but did use them a few times and caught fish when nobody else did. Problem with fishing in really bad flood conditions is actually keeping your bait near the bottom. These float took between 10-16BB bulked 18 inches from the hook with another bulk of No 8's as droppers. I once used them on the Ouse (Bedfordshire) and caught over 100 fish on maggot. I had to use a bait dropper just to get some feed near the bottom. I think I won my section, but nowhere in the match as chub were caught as normal. I was really surprised how good they were for bite detection. The Roach I caught were fairly small, but this great big cumbersome float just sailed under. I know it was because of all the shot. It's a fallacy that you have to fish light to detect shy biting fish.

[Backhand]

Yes it makes sense Backhand, Conditions can change a few extra inches off water can make a massive different to the peg. A flyer which only fishes well with no water in can sometime be useless with a couple of foot extra in. I only fish club matches and after a few years you get to know things inside out. But I can imagine fishing big opens would be very different with little knowledge of the river.

MA

One of my favourite things to do match wise. Was to go and fish someone else's water that I had never seen before. When I get chance to do it, my first post about making floats for a specific reason will be about just that.
It's good to know your home waters inside out though. Another matchmans adage is just that, find a water that you like and become an expert on it. The reason I prefered Canals was the methods you fished didn't vary much between the sections. The same methods tended to work over 50 miles of canal. With river fishing as you know, it can change more than once on one stretch. You end up taking to much bait, just in case you draw certain areas. But I used to love pleasure fishing on Rivers when you can chose your peg.

[Match Aerial]

Yes they worked really well I will need to experiment further with them.
In comparision to the cane stemmed Avons in a decent flow they remained very upright and did not tend to lean like the cane stem jobs do.
I think it was the reduction in stem dia which decreases water pressure on the float stem. Fished very like a wire stem but a bit lighter than the steel piano wire. Reason why I am saying this is not sure if the extra stability is totally down to the weight of the stem?
I like to try new things, sometimes I end up going round in a full circle Lol
Part of the fun mate

[Match Aerial]

Yes it makes sense Backhand, Conditions can change a few extra inches off water can make a massive different to the peg. A flyer which only fishes well with no water in can sometime be useless with a couple of foot extra in. I only fish club matches and after a few years you get to know things inside out. But I can imagine fishing big opens would be very different with little knowledge of the river.

MA

One of my favourite things to do match wise. Was to go and fish someone else's water that I had never seen before. When I get chance to do it, my first post about making floats for a specific reason will be about just that.
It's good to know your home waters inside out though. Another matchmans adage is just that, find a water that you like and become an expert on it. The reason I prefered Canals was the methods you fished didn't vary much between the sections. The same methods tended to work over 50 miles of canal. With river fishing as you know, it can change more than once on one stretch. You end up taking to much bait, just in case you draw certain areas. But I used to love pleasure fishing on Rivers when you can chose your peg.

I must admit I am not very adventurous I tend to stick to the same angling clubs I have fished for the last 40yrs. But like you say you do get to know it like the back of your hand after the first 39yrs of it

[Backhand]

Yes they worked really well I will need to experiment further with them.
In comparision to the cane stemmed Avons in a decent flow they remained very upright and did not tend to lean like the cane stem jobs do.
I think it was the reduction in stem dia which decreases water pressure on the float stem. Fished very like a wire stem but a bit lighter than the steel piano wire. Reason why I am saying this is not sure if the extra stability is totally down to the weight of the stem?
I like to try new things, sometimes I end up going round in a full circle Lol
Part of the fun mate

You and me both.
Yes you are probably right about the water pressure on the float stem. I will admit I'm not a river expert by any length of imagination. But I do understand fishing in general. it doesn't matter whether your a river angler or canal angler the basics of fishing are much the same. Water craft or understanding how things work are the same in all aspects of fishing. Although it's hard to achieve unless you are shaping the balsa part of the float with a lathe type gadget, but giving the balsa bit of a step can help it not to ride up. Also where you put the eye or float rubber at the top can make a big difference. If you can make the step at a 45º angle and put an eye there, the force of the water should help to keep the float down.